Legalise Cannabis

**Will** · 08-11-2008, 10:49 PM

This topic never gets old for me, and I'm a little rusty on it so let's put it through the wringer again! Especially now that it looks like America is edging ever close to the day it will be decriminalised. With our dumb ass PM going against his own commission and reclassifying Cannabis back to 'B', the UK is falling back in the dark ages!

Here's my little list of reasons which it should be so. If it were legal:

1. A huge amount of police resources would be freed up, including money.
2. Organised crime would be dealt a crushing blow, as one of it's major incomes suddenly poofs into thin air.
3. It would be taxed, sending billions of pounds into government coffers, rather than the criminal element.
4. Availability would mean it's price would plummet, this would allow far safer ways to consume it such as eating or using a vaporizer. Even better aerosol or spray forms of the drug would become available, also far safer.
5. Allowing it to be legal would mean education on the drug would increase dramatically.
6. It would lose its rebellious status.
7. People could use it without fear and without having to resort to calling in on drug dealers, who are usually far more harmful to your health.

How it should be done:

1. It should be legal to use in the privacy of your own home, or open public places. Maybe even public houses in non-smokable forms.
2. It should remain as it is now, completely illegal to drive or operate heavy machinery while under the influence.
3. It should be sold under the counter, and with no advertising to discourage influencing non users to try it.
4. It should be legal to grow it if you choose.
5. It should be legal only for over 18s (maybe even 21s).
6. Special care should be made to warm people who are prone to schizophrenia, that using the drug can aggravate their condition.

Anyone disagree? I hope so, won't be much of a debate if not. Also, anyone think there's anything I've missed?

skinny · 08-12-2008, 12:29 AM

Would the "saved" police resources be put onto growing "good shit"?

2, is debatable...cig's?

3, ?

4, ?

5, Widespread at the minute mi thinks, it's growing up that is lacking?

6, rebelious?

7, drug dealers neeeed you...never forget tha, lol

**Will** · 08-12-2008, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skinny

Would the "saved" police resources be put onto growing "good shit"?

That's one possibility. If nothing else they'd have more time to fill out the triplicate forms about what they had for breakfast.

Quote:

2, is debatable...cig's?

It is fair to say that the tabacco black market is rising, but the majority of cigs still bought are done legally. In any case, if the government didn't tax tabacco so greedily, the black market wouldn't be growing.

Quote:

3, ?

4, ?

?

Quote:

5, Widespread at the minute mi thinks, it's growing up that is lacking?

Not sure what you mean by that, but half the time users are only slightly less naive then people who have never even seen it.

Quote:

6, rebelious?

Yeah, the fact that something is illegal is quite a turn on for the young and impressionable.

Quote:

7, drug dealers neeeed you...never forget tha, lol

The other thing I forgot to mention, is that drug dealers often contaminate drugs with other substances. In cannabis's case, super fine grit is being added to cannabis to increase its weight. This grit is extremely bad for your lungs.

Casper · 10-27-2008, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will

Here's my little list of reasons which it should be so. If it were legal:

1. A huge amount of police resources would be freed up, including money.
2. Organised crime would be dealt a crushing blow, as one of it's major incomes suddenly poofs into thin air.
3. It would be taxed, sending billions of pounds into government coffers, rather than the criminal element.
4. Availability would mean it's price would plummet, this would allow far safer ways to consume it such as eating or using a vaporizer. Even better aerosol or spray forms of the drug would become available, also far safer.
5. Allowing it to be legal would mean education on the drug would increase dramatically.
6. It would lose its rebellious status.
7. People could use it without fear and without having to resort to calling in on drug dealers, who are usually far more harmful to your health.

Will, I generally agree with your argument that cannabis should be legalised.

However, what do you say to sceptics whom claim that this sends out the wrong message and would encourage people to take more drugs?

**Will** · 10-28-2008, 06:33 PM

I'd say if that people are made to understand that there's a differance between use and abuse, it's not really a problem if more people use it. Just like many legal drugs.

If it were easily available, it could actually be readily available in edible form, which has no proven long term detrimental effects.

Casper · 10-28-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will

Here's my little list of reasons which it should be so. If it were legal:

1. A huge amount of police resources would be freed up, including money.
2. Organised crime would be dealt a crushing blow, as one of it's major incomes suddenly poofs into thin air.
3. It would be taxed, sending billions of pounds into government coffers, rather than the criminal element.
4. Availability would mean it's price would plummet, this would allow far safer ways to consume it such as eating or using a vaporizer. Even better aerosol or spray forms of the drug would become available, also far safer.
5. Allowing it to be legal would mean education on the drug would increase dramatically.
6. It would lose its rebellious status.
7. People could use it without fear and without having to resort to calling in on drug dealers, who are usually far more harmful to your health.

I've been thinking about these points and wondering if you could also apply them to supporting the legalisation of other illegal drugs.

Why do you only consider cannabis? What about other drugs?

**Will** · 10-29-2008, 02:53 PM

That's a good question. I can't answer with the level of knowledge I have about cannabis though. What I would say is that there is definitely a good case for it. Many drugs out there are so dangerous BECAUSE they are illegal, cocaine for instance it mixed with everything from Ajax to rat poison. Most heroin users OD because the doses they are given are highly inconsistent in their purity. Ecstasy users don't die from the drug, they die from drinking too much water, or not enough.
At the same time though. Some of these drugs are highly addictive, and it would be idiotic to legalise them to the point where they can be bought off a shelf. But there is a very strong case for making some of these drugs freely available to registered users. This would cut out drug related crime completely, and it would also put the drug barons out of business. Ironically is would cost considerably less money to do this, then it does to enforce it's illegal status.
I think the point is, that each drug has to be looked at individually. The goal is simply to take the control and the money away from the cartels, however this needs to be done.

Casper · 10-30-2008, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will

... there is a very strong case for making some of these drugs freely available to registered users. This would cut out drug related crime completely, and it would also put the drug barons out of business. Ironically it would cost considerably less money to do this, then it does to enforce it's illegal status.

On what source do you base this claim on? I couldn't find a source of information to verify that it would cost less to legalise drugs than it would to enforce its illegal status. I think you could be right, but I'm still wondering to what extent it is true.

**Will** · 10-31-2008, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casper

On what source do you base this claim on? I couldn't find a source of information to verify that it would cost less to legalise drugs than it would to enforce its illegal status. I think you could be right, but I'm still wondering to what extent it is true.

It's and old fact and I can't cite it's source, but I can back it up with a bit of rational thinking quite easily. A dose of heroin costs a couple of quid at the most though legal sources, even at street price it only costs about £10. Now to catch and convict just one heroin addict, requires police officers and a court, which runs into tens of thousands of pounds. Then there is the cost of the crimes addicts commit to feed their habit, and the police time, and court time THAT would also involve. We could also factor in the cost of sending out ambulances when one ODs, the NHS cost of treating them when so many of their veins collapse they risk losing a limb or even thier life. Not to mention the cost of TIME on all these resources.

To give you an idea, drugs and drug related crime take up ONE THIRD of police resources. Imagine that, one third of the police force is freed up almost over night!

Casper · 11-01-2008, 03:48 AM

Will, I found the following summary that adds to your argument for the legalisation of drugs:

1) Regulation. Illegal drugs are cut with all kinds of ****. Legalised drugs would be regulated and so wouldn't be full of crap. This makes them much, much safer for use. The impurities in drugs are harmful and cause (extra) damage. Varying levels of concentration are also to blame for lots of OD's.

2) Tax. Speaks for itself. Alcohol and tobacco more than make up in tax revenue what they cost the NHS. Something like ?2 billion a year in cost, ?6 billion a year in tax revenue. There is no reason why illegal drugs would be different.

3) Saves money. The War on Drugs is astronomically expensive and the police can focus time, money and effort on catching real criminals rather than pursuing addicts.

4) There is no reason to believe it will increase the number of users. In the UK when weed was re-classified to C instead of B, the number of users fell from 11% to 8%. In Holland, weed usage fell after its decriminalisation. In Geneva a test program where heroin users were given safe drugs and a place to do it in caused the number of new users to fall by 80%. If you ask someone why they don't do crack it's usually because they don't want to be a crackhead, not because the police might lock them up.

5) Lowers crime. I don't just mean drug possession/dealing. Drug dealing gangs are responsible for huge amounts of crime. Cutting out a major source of their income will cut crime.

6) Drug barons go bust/legit. Drug barons aren't nice people. This would put the money into the hands of CEO's instead. Not a huge improvement I must say but most CEO's aren't quite as bad as drug barons. Either that or drug barons will go legit. Not an ideal solution but still cuts crime.

7) Free up prison space. The UK prison system is dangerously overcrowded and the less said about the size of the US prison system the better. Suffice to say that there will be far more room in prisons when we stop locking people up for having an addiction.

8) Hypocrisy. There is no reason why tobacco and alcohol should be legal and acceptable and other drugs shouldn't be. Far more people are killed by those two. Far more violence is caused by alcohol. Etc etc. It doesn't make sense and tradition is not a reason for anything.

9) Cheaper. If drugs are legal then they'd be cheaper (even when taxed). This would mean that drug addicts wouldn't have to steal (or would have to steal less) to obtain drugs. Lots of crime is caused by this and getting rid of it sounds good.

10) People will be less afraid of getting help for their addictions and will make it easier for people to get into rehab or whatever. As it stands, it's kind of awkward given the illegal status of drugs. It's easier to quit tobacco and alcohol because you can get lots of help from the NHS and lots of other charities. Illegal drugs don't have this.

11) Freedom. Even without the other 10 reasons (which IMO are more than enough to warrant legalisation) I would still advocate legalisation for the very simple reason that it is the not the government's place to tell me what I can do to myself for my own enjoyment. I can slice a razorblade across my arm, why I can't I stick a syringe full of heroin in? It seems ridiculous that there are actually chemicals which are banned. A somewhat backwards view for the 21st century.