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Thread: Speaking of Por - Censorship

  1. #11
    Administrator Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HonestJoe View Post
    That's how a number of filtering programs already work. I'm in complete agreement that no system is perfect. The actual technical aspect of implementing the filter (and all the related difficulties) isn't changed by the proposal though.
    They're not just imperfect, they are incredibly easy to get around if you know what you're doing. The only the perfect filtering system is attentive parenting.

    You can be as insulting as you like, you're not going to eliminate the significant number of people with little or no practical computer literacy.
    You don't have to be computer literate to follow a few VERY simple instructions. This is still a non-argument to me, I refuse to accept that we need internet censorship because a small minority of people are too stupid to know how to switch a filter on for themselves.

    Because changing it wouldn't be about a button or password on the computer itself but a process of contacting the ISP, confirming you are actually the customer and receiving some form of notification of the change. There is potential to mess it up but it should be more secure from cunning kids.
    I'm afraid that is completely irrelevant, you wouldn't even need to know the password to circumvent any such filter. There are literally hundreds of different ways of doing it.

    But they wouldn't need to have the technical savvy because the ISP would (should!) explain the choice in simple terms and offer a clear yes or no.
    I don't understand why you can so easily accept that an ISP can easily explain a simple choice like this in terms thave even simple users could understand. Yet you think it would mystify some users if ISPs tried to explain how to put in a password and select one of two options. One being 'On' the other being 'Off'.

    I'm not advocating censorship. This isn't about censorship. This is about offering a choice. You'd be free to opt-out and use whatever systems (or lack thereof) you currently have.
    This IS censorship. This is a government initiative to block 'adult content' on the internet, unless you opt out. We ALREADY HAVE this option, we don't need nanny interfering. You seem blind to the fact the ALL governments want MORE control of the internet, this is just one of many steps. Once they realise how utterly ineffective this initiative will be, a far more clandestine "initiative will be explored.
    Yes, when it was assumed that you could beat a confession out of pretty much anyone within 24 hours.
    Following on from above, this is a perfect example of how a step at a time our rights are eroded, apparently for our own good.
    That could happen now (I suspect it generally doesn't - it'd be more effecitve to monitor). Using this system wouldn't be a very effective method since it would be immediately obvious when the opt-out people could see it and the opt-in ones couldn't.
    The government is already apparently exploring options to block social media on occasions that 'The Government' decides it is necessary.

    http://www.metro.co.uk/tech/872080-u...media-shutdown

    Similar things happened in the middle-east, for instance Egypt's whole internet was simply switched off during their uprising. It really doesn't take a great leap of imagination to see that is where we are heading.

    In what context was that single-word quote used?
    It wasn't. It's the one word that deliberately doesn't get used, even though that is exactly what it is.

    To reiterate what I said above, you need to look at the bigger picture. We are seeing more and more examples of how governments are seeking to control the net, this is just one example. Here's another:

    http://volokh.com/2011/10/18/french-...ce-misconduct/

    In Australia, their government already routinely decides which Internet sites it wants to stop Australians from seeing. While some of the material banned makes sense such as child pornography - which incidently won't actually do anything to tackle the problem of peadophiles. It also includes banning, "online poker sites, YouTube links, regular gay and straight porn sites, Wikipedia entries, euthanasia sites, websites of fringe religions such as satanic sites, fetish sites, Christian sites, the website of a tour operator and even a Queensland dentist." At one stage they even banned Wikileaks, which isn't a problem now as the US has seen to it that the entire wikileaks URL is banned!

    http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2009/...054961100.html

    This article in the Guardian sums up the whole problem with internet censorship.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...good-parenting
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  2. #12
    Senior Member Mr Muckspreader's Avatar
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    Default Turn it on its head

    The simple thing to do would be to keep the internet 'free' but allow concerned parents to have opt in to a content managed service. It is not hard to do and I am sure that the ISPs have all the kit to do it. FFS I have set up a Sonic Wall managed firewall for the building that I have my office in and I can add or delete users from Groups that have blocked content or not. The simple thing is give users the choice of either being 'IN' or 'OUT' of a content managed system. How much simpler can it be?
    I do suspect that there may be more sinister motives behind the Governments approach such as state control of what we view online.

    Mr Muck

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    Admin Will - Think for yourself, it hasn't been banned, yet.
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    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
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    It has been revealed last year the US law enforcement agency requested Google remove a number of videos that showed police brutality. Not only that, but the agency also requested the information of the people who uploaded the images to YouTube. There has been a 70% rise in take-down requests by government agencies from around the globe, in relation to videos that display those government agencies in an insalubrious light: "Figures revealed for the first time show that the US demanded private information about more than 11,000 Google users between January and June this year, almost equal to the number of requests made by 25 other developed countries, including the UK and Russia. Governments around the world requested private data about 25,440 people in the first half of this year, with 11,057 of those people in the US." Google has resisted all demands for these take-down requests, and has stoically defended the rights of their members to broadcast, and their right to anonymity.

    It is clear the move against the freedom of the internet is becoming a political priority, and whatever means the Imperial governments can attack the freedoms of users, they will undoubtedly use them, such as tagging the users of pornography. It is indeed a slippery slope Will. But if we can count on the support of web-companies, then the fight will be made all that more difficult. Let us be aware, without the freedom of the internet, autocratic dictators would not have fallen this summer.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...eport-released
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    Administrator Will's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    Let us be aware, without the freedom of the internet, autocratic dictators would not have fallen this summer.
    Exactly, it played a key role in several uprisings. Here's a link I just found about what the UK is doing. It's already worse than I thought, they're already taking down videos on YouTube.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15459123

    It seems the people of the world are slowly but surely losing the internet to the control of governments. I doubt we can count on support from any commercial aspect of the net, as the governments have them over a barrel. The worse part is, how do we fight this?

    As an interesting side note, what I just said above could be interpreted as extreme because I use the term 'fight'. That's something to think about for people who aren't sure why it's necessary to keep the internet out of government control. Your store enough information about a person, and eventually you'll find a way to smear their character if you so wish.
    Last edited by Will; 10-27-2011 at 10:33 PM.
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  6. #16
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    It seems the US are really ramping things up.

    https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/1...99s-worse-ever

    The good news is that there's at least one organisation out there trying to stop the hostile take-over of the internet.
    Admin Will - Think for yourself, it hasn't been banned, yet.
    "When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."
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