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Thread: Threatening Gay Marriage

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Casper View Post
    I don't believe it's acceptable to force anyone to do anything. Discrimination is this context simply means to make a difference / exception. But we make such discriminatory choices between people all the time. Why is this wrong?
    It is isn't like rejecting a job applicant on the basis of their scruffy appearance, or turning down the offer of a date with someone because of their bad breath. Churches are providing a public service to people who wish to be married, and turning down couples based on their sexuality would be wrong. You are just not allowed to discriminate on that basis.

    I know some Xians say that it is written in the Bible that homosexuality is wrong. My answer to them is simple. Edit your Bible and remove/alter the offending articles. It is not like the Bible hasn't been edited before. It was substantially edited in the 3rd century for Roman comsumption after Emporer Constantine adopted Xianity. Entire gospels relating to JC were unceremoniously kicked out. Most of the anti-gay stuff is in the Old Testament anyway, which most Xian's say should be ignored in favour of the New Testament.

  2. #12
    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
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    As much as I may disagree with some of the teachings of Christianity, the Church is pretty much bound by that code, and so anything outside of those teachings will create a schism within the Church and could necessarily pull it apart; much like the ordination of women nearly ripped the CoE apart. I don't understand, however, why gay people pander to a religious service, if that religion is so against their union. Why not just accept a civil partnership within a legal and social framework?
    Faced with certain disaster, defiance is the only answer.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    As much as I may disagree with some of the teachings of Christianity, the Church is pretty much bound by that code, and so anything outside of those teachings will create a schism within the Church and could necessarily pull it apart
    Quite possibly. But then the more progressive splinter of the church will likely flourish, whilst the regressive splinter will diminish - much like the way Protestantism replaced Catholicism in the affections of people across much of Northern Europe during the 16th-17th centuries.

    The point I was trying to make is that there is nothing sacred about scripture. The books of the Bible (and the Koran and the Torah) were written by human hands and they have been edited when humans have found it appropriate (especially the Bible). No reason why they can't be edited again in the present or the future. Its all a load of tosh anyway!

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    Homosexuality doesn't make sense what so ever. I don't agree with it because it stirs up to many potential problems in the future as the gay population increases. Scientists still haven't discovered the reason why people are gay.
    Now we are seeing more of this "gender identification Disorder" crap. It just seems a strange direction for evolution to go. Religion is right to reject it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andeeg1 View Post
    Homosexuality doesn't make sense what so ever. I don't agree with it because it stirs up to many potential problems in the future as the gay population increases. Scientists still haven't discovered the reason why people are gay.
    Now we are seeing more of this "gender identification Disorder" crap. It just seems a strange direction for evolution to go. Religion is right to reject it.
    I'm sure it makes perfect sense to a homosexual! We all discriminate as regards to who we find attractive. Rod Stewart only seems to like blonde women who are at least 12 inches taller than him! Who are we to criticise others for who they find attractive, as long as they are attracted to consenting adults? There is no evidence that the number of gay people are increasing ... its probably been between 2-4% of the population throughout human history. The number of people who are infertile for other medical reasons is probably of a similar, if not greater, order. Evolution can easily cope with this as long as the species is successful anyway.

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    There just seems to be to many unanswered questions for me to fully accept it(not that it matters whether I accept it or not). And there is enough problems with religion without forcing them to embrace the mordern absurdity of society. Any religious people are only going to resent gays more.
    Last edited by Andeeg1; 05-30-2012 at 04:03 PM.

  7. #17
    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
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    If we didn't think the purge against homosexual marriage could cross the Atlantic, a very hard-line group of MPs and clerics have produced a leaflet that considers if Britain does allow gay marriage then it will open the door to other extreme forms of relationship, like polygamy, incest and further illegal immigration: ""The immigration service is already swamped with false marriages – this would only add to their problems.""

    Like I said previously, if this is the kind of hate and prejudice homosexuals can expect from religious unions, then why on earth would they want to be part of it. Be happy with the civil partnership where you are accepted by society under the Law rather than someone's God.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...-door-polygamy
    Faced with certain disaster, defiance is the only answer.

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    Junior Member mostyn's Avatar
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    Like I said previously, if this is the kind of hate and prejudice homosexuals can expect from religious unions, then why on earth would they want to be part of it. Be happy with the civil partnership where you are accepted by society under the Law rather than someone's God.




    EMW, Firstly, I am a Christian and not at all prejudice against gays. Neither is the Church rejecting gays, it is just the intimate act between two same s e x couples that the Church has difficulty with, for obvious reasons , but in some cases same sex unions are blessed in Church.
    I have worked alongside gays and find them the most friendly and trustworthy people I know, some have religious convictions and feel it important to have their partnership blessed.
    We also know that some priests are gay, but remain celibate. So the Catholic Church does not reject gays unless they can't handle being celibate.
    Which to my mind can be very difficult.
    Last edited by mostyn; 09-23-2012 at 09:13 AM.

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    Senior Member Rook's Avatar
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    I find myself in the awkward position of supporting gay marriage in the US, but not in the UK so much. Gays in this country already have civil partnerships, which give them the same rights and responsibilities as married straight people. Yes, they are not technically "married" but they 'enjoy' all the same rights as the rest of us. Trying to change the law, in order to amend the symbolism of their relationships, doesn't seem worth the time, money and effort. As I see it, there will be very few (if any?) tangible benefits to changing the law.

    I just wish that Labour had the balls to introduce gay marriage at the time, instead of opting for civil partnerships.

    Regarding gay marriage in church, it should be up to the individual churches/religions to decide. If they are not happy, then they should be free to exercise freedom of religion. But if they are happy, then let them - the Quakers are keen I understand.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mostyn View Post
    EMW, Firstly, I am a Christian and not at all prejudice against gays. Neither is the Church rejecting gays, it is just the intimate act between two same s e x couples that the Church has difficulty with, for obvious reasons , but in some cases same sex unions are blessed in Church.
    Hello Mostyn and welcome to the forum!

    It sounds like you are a Christian of the reasonable and moderately minded sort. However, can't you see, even from the statement you have written above, how out of touch the church is on this subject? Gay people don't want to be tolerated by the church as long as they don't have sex with each other. It is not natural to force celibacy onto someone, and in fact it is downright dangerous leading to all sorts of psychological problems. It is little wonder that many Catholic priests and nuns have turned to the sexual abuse of children.

    If Churches conduct legal wedding ceremonies then I am afraid they are part of the apparatus of the state. In fact, I believe they cherish this role. In which case, they need to obey the laws of society, which includes not discriminating against couples on the basis of their sexual orientation. What argument is there against the idea that two people of the same sex cannot form a loving and permanent bond and have their relationship solemnised in the same way as a heterosexual couple? None that I can think of.

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