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Thread: The idiotic war on drugs!

  1. #21
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    Well I used to smoke years ago (22 years ago actually ), I partake of caffeinated coffee every morning, and I've taken 'pharmaceuticals' at various times in my life, and none of them have ever had any brain-bending effects on me. Sounds like I know more than you do about this subject!!

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollyof39 View Post
    Well I used to smoke years ago (22 years ago actually ), I partake of caffeinated coffee every morning, and I've taken 'pharmaceuticals' at various times in my life, and none of them have ever had any brain-bending effects on me. Sounds like I know more than you do about this subject!!
    Well, we've already established that factual evidence isn't a prerequisite for you forming an opinion, so it hardly surprises me you'd reach this ill-informed conclusion. Just because you claim to have never had any "mind-bending" effects, doesn't change the hard scientific fact that all these drugs have an effect on the brain.

    Alcohol has severe effects on the mind both under the influence and when sober. Not limited to memory impairment, euphoria, depression, and can even cause long-term mental issues such as schizophrenia, Bipolar disease, etc. It is also addictive.

    Nicotine can cause depression. "Nicotine activates the circuitry that regulates feelings of pleasure, the so-called reward pathways. Research has shown that nicotine increases the levels of dopamine (a key brain chemical involved in mediating the desire to consume drugs) in the reward circuits." It is also highly addictive due to the way it effects the brain. http://www.psychologytoday.com/conditions/nicotine

    Caffeine in high doses can cause anxiety, auditory hallucinations, it can cause withdrawal symptoms including headache, fatigue and decreased alertness. It is also more addictive than cannabis.

    Even Paracetamol has been shown to produce anxiety.

    Those are just the negative effects, there are positive effects to all these as well. But it doesn't change the fact that your claim that these drugs have no psychological effects is utter rubbish.
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    Even more experts coming forward with their research.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24342421

    It amazes me in this day and age that ignorance and archaic attitudes are still dictating policy over evidence and fact.
    Admin Will - Think for yourself, it hasn't been banned, yet.
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    It discourages me to think that after years of ready access to information on almost any topic, there are still so many people who display such plainly loony views on 9/11, climate change, the Holocaust, politics, etc, etc, etc, and who are unable to debate without continually regurgitating the same entrenched blinkered views. Both extremes in the drugs debate need to be ignored so that opposing, informed views can be rationally considered...
    Last edited by Patman Post; 10-01-2013 at 02:38 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ollyof39 View Post
    Well I used to smoke years ago (22 years ago actually ), I partake of caffeinated coffee every morning, and I've taken 'pharmaceuticals' at various times in my life, and none of them have ever had any brain-bending effects on me
    Are you sure about that?
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  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Will View Post
    Considering legalisation has reduced drug consuption, how did you reach this conclusion? Show me some evidence.



    And?



    No problem: 40 Million people drink alcohol in the UK on a regular basis.

    http://www.avon.nhs.uk/alcohol/the_facts.htm

    That represent near enough the ENTIRE adult population of the UK.

    http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/census...dom/index.html

    That's just alcohol, we're not even talking about nicotine, pharmaceuticals, caffeine, etc.
    I can't give you evidence of a future trend, I was speculating using unscientific common sense - so I could be wrong. However, I would be genuinely interested to have the data you have that shows that legislation reduces consumption. If you have that data, has it been proven that the two are linked beyond doubt?

    Re 'No problem' ..... AHHH! Right!!! Stupid me!!!! When you started this thread 'The idiotic war on drugs!', I didn't realise you meant that the 'F***ing government retards are fighting a war that can never be won' against tea coffee alcohol and paracetamol. I must keep my lapsang souchong teabags and ibuprofen better hidden in case the police come busting in at 3a.m. Is my drinking chocolate safe? - Perhaps I'll stick to Horlicks.
    Last edited by molesworth1; 10-01-2013 at 04:03 PM. Reason: grammar

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    Quote Originally Posted by molesworth1 View Post
    I can't give you evidence of a future trend, I was speculating using unscientific common sense - so I could be wrong. However, I would be genuinely interested to have the data you have that shows that legislation reduces consumption. If you have that data, has it been proven that the two are linked beyond doubt?
    This article cites many sources of research into POrtugal's methods:
    http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...riminalization
    This talks about the results:
    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...d931c6f679.5e1

    The Swiss pioneerd the idea of assisted help for addicts, they were doing it long before it was ever considered in the UK. It has been such a stunning success that it has been made permanent.
    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...804-1/abstract
    http://www.beckleyfoundation.org/pdf...ngPaper_18.pdf

    "Not only is the number of drug-using delinquents falling, but so is the number of drug-related crimes. We are even recording a 90% reduction in the frequency of crimes against property and hard-drug trafficking committed by drug users on heroin prescription programmes. Decreasing crime rates included an 85% reduction in cases of shop-lifting and a 76% fall in the sale of hashish.”25

    As the 1999 study observed,Heroin prescription removes the pressure caused by the need to find money to buy drugs. After one year of treatment, patients report a 100% drop in criminal behaviour (mostly burglary) and an 83% drop in the sale of hard drugs"


    In the Netherlands where cannabis has been decriminalised for a long time, it's cannabis use is less than countries with strict laws on the drug -such as the UK and the US.
    http://www.beckleyfoundation.org/pdf...ee%20shops.pdf

    The point is this, the claim that legalised/decriminalised drugs would lead to higher drugs use is unsupported bullshit, and certainly doesn't fit with what we know so far.

    Re 'No problem' ..... AHHH! Right!!! Stupid me!!!! When you started this thread 'The idiotic war on drugs!', I didn't realise you meant that the 'F***ing government retards are fighting a war that can never be won' against tea coffee alcohol and paracetamol. I must keep my lapsang souchong teabags and ibuprofen better hidden in case the police come busting in at 3a.m. Is my drinking chocolate safe? - Perhaps I'll stick to Horlicks.
    I didn't. It appears you're now sadly confused. You've gone from asking me to qualify my statement that the majority of UK residents are drug users, and I have; to combining two unrelated statements to conclude I said something I didn't. Do you consider this to be a useful debating tool? From here it looks like you're throwing your rattle out of your pram because you can't find anything intelligent to say.

    "The true f**king retards in this situation are the people who use illegal drugs. As well as the unbelievably stupid and selfish act of destroying their own health and economic productivity,"

    "The fact remains that almost everyone over the age of 18 is a regular drug user, yet the country seems to manage. What people like you also fail to appreciate is that drug use goes down when it is legalised."

    This is how the conversation was going before you tried to call me up on what I said. I was pointing out the hypocritical statement on Northumbrian, and his preconceived Daily Mail, bullshit notions (as well as several other people's on this thread) that people who use drugs are useless layabouts, who are a danger to themselves and society; while ignoring the fact that there are legal drug users in the UK who cause for more problems to the Police and the NHS.

    Speaking for myself, I am a regular cannabis user, and dabble in various other class A's on rare occasions. I have a high ranking technical job in a major International Broadcasting network, own three houses, and lead a modestly successful life. Which what makes we laugh when I see idiots describing me as a useless waster who's a danger to myself and society. It's utter bullshit, and the hundreds of millions of people who are just like me know it's bullshit too. Of course there are addicts who cannot moderate themselves, but those people need help, not a prison sentence.
    Last edited by Will; 10-02-2013 at 06:21 AM.
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  8. #28

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    That's interesting. You are successful - great - you 'sound' coherent, although you come over as a bit highly strung, but that could just be living and/or working in the fast lane. I think you are an intelligent materialistic neo-socialist. I would be interested to know why you want, or feel the need to take drugs. I don't take any 'substances' (except tea, and a beer at the weekend), I live life in the slow lane, own a small roof over my head, and would chuck everything I own down the tip without any compunction. So am on the outside looking in at folk like you, and I am both curious and fascinated at what makes you tick.

    OK, can we say from now on, that when you define something in a thread, then you stick to that definition - and not move the goalposts to suit.

    I'll have a look at those sites later. You're probably right.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by molesworth1 View Post
    I can't give you evidence of a future trend, I was speculating using unscientific common sense - so I could be wrong. However, I would be genuinely interested to have the data you have that shows that legislation reduces consumption. If you have that data, has it been proven that the two are linked beyond doubt?

    Re 'No problem' ..... AHHH! Right!!! Stupid me!!!! When you started this thread 'The idiotic war on drugs!', I didn't realise you meant that the 'F***ing government retards are fighting a war that can never be won' against tea coffee alcohol and paracetamol. I must keep my lapsang souchong teabags and ibuprofen better hidden in case the police come busting in at 3a.m. Is my drinking chocolate safe? - Perhaps I'll stick to Horlicks.


    But actually the war against dealers and pushers can be won - summary execution after covert surveillance of 'pushing' has been observed where, and whenever there is positive observation, and no questions asked; I'm afraid that's the only thing which is going to resolve it once and for all . . . unless anyone's got a better idea??? Will? EMW? I'm waiting!

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by molesworth1 View Post
    That's interesting. You are successful - great - you 'sound' coherent, although you come over as a bit highly strung, but that could just be living and/or working in the fast lane. I think you are an intelligent materialistic neo-socialist.
    Wrong, I'm not materialistic at all. My entire worldly possessions could probably fit in one medium sized box. Excepting my Car (which is vital in a country with no public transport), and my houses which are my investments for the future and will help fund the geology course I want to do and funding my eventual dream of running a guest house on the Sri Lankan South coast. As for being highly strung, how you could possibly tell that by reading words is hard to fathom.

    I would be interested to know why you want, or feel the need to take drugs. I don't take any 'substances' (except tea, and a beer at the weekend), I live life in the slow lane, own a small roof over my head, and would chuck everything I own down the tip without any compunction. So am on the outside looking in at folk like you, and I am both curious and fascinated at what makes you tick.
    I'm sure it does fascinate you, but I'm afraid the boring truth is there's really nothing extraordinarily different about someone who likes using cannabis to relax to someone who uses alcohol on the weekends. Chances are you probably meet people who take illegal drugs all the time and don't even realise it. Why do you want or need beer or get drunk? If you know the answer to that you've probably answered your own question. It's fun, it changes your perspective for a time, cannabis in particular gives you a mild euphoric feeling, it allows you see the beauty and elegance in many things you usually take for granted in every day life, it makes you think, it makes you laugh - contrary to the Daily Mail's propaganda it doesn't turn you into a paranoid, dribbling ("Zombie") wreck that goes round causing trouble or festering on the sofa all day while not getting a job. Still, no words can ever really sum it up, you're only ever going to find out by bring brave and trying it for yourself.

    OK, can we say from now on, that when you define something in a thread, then you stick to that definition - and not move the goalposts to suit.
    Can't make any promises since you don't give the slightest indication of what goal-posts I've supposedly moved, or provide an example.

    I'll have a look at those sites later. You're probably right.
    Admin Will - Think for yourself, it hasn't been banned, yet.
    "When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."
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