Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 34

Thread: David Cameron Upholds Spying

  1. #21
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,000

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ollyof39 View Post
    They didn't think they were dumb, they thought they wouldn't get involved! The entire western hemisphere has got dumb actually and that's why Islam's on the move. I'd argue that might be a good thing actually.
    And How dumb was that? because the Yanks would have been dumb, if they had of let those two batter us, because they would have then had to take on two victorious well honed fighting machines all on there own.
    Islam, is on the move as you say but no one has gone dumb on that fact. The Islamic world has never been fond of the west or the christians in it, and now in the modern world they can bring that dislike to our door steps. Whats possibly dumb is the notion that the people we charge with confronting that situation for us should do so with their hands tied behind their backs, as is the case when we are questioning their every move.

  2. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    London N16
    Posts
    675

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    I would just like to know what the thinking is behind spying on your allies.
    They're only allies if they or their friendship is useful. As for spying, I'd guess it's a dead cert each side even double checks on its own...

  3. #23
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    London N16
    Posts
    675

    Default

    Heard Guardian journalist Glenn Greenwald justifying his and the media's role in publicising the Snowden material. Seems he and the world media are best qualified at selecting what information should be lifted from anywhere and broadcast. It also appears it's OK to use stolen stuff to slap down specific governments if they happen to interfere with a journalists particular personal freedoms if they act to find out what info's been copied and try to get it back...

  4. #24
    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kingston upon Hull
    Posts
    2,473

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Patman Post View Post
    Heard Guardian journalist Glenn Greenwald justifying his and the media's role in publicising the Snowden material. Seems he and the world media are best qualified at selecting what information should be lifted from anywhere and broadcast. It also appears it's OK to use stolen stuff to slap down specific governments if they happen to interfere with a journalists particular personal freedoms if they act to find out what info's been copied and try to get it back...
    Was it really stolen if it's national property?
    Faced with certain disaster, defiance is the only answer.

  5. #25
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    London N16
    Posts
    675

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    Was it really stolen if it's national property?
    If property (actual or intellectual, in hard copy or electronic form) is taken from its owner by a third party without permission that would seem to be theft. If taking national property is no longer a crime, there's fortune to made in bronze, copper and lead from the state-owned buildings and statues around London...

  6. #26
    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kingston upon Hull
    Posts
    2,473

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Patman Post View Post
    If property (actual or intellectual, in hard copy or electronic form) is taken from its owner by a third party without permission that would seem to be theft. If taking national property is no longer a crime, there's fortune to made in bronze, copper and lead from the state-owned buildings and statues around London...
    But the owner is the government, and it has been sustained that some of the details in the files were in the national interest. So the end justifies the means in my opinion.
    Faced with certain disaster, defiance is the only answer.

  7. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,000

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    But the owner is the government, and it has been sustained that some of the details in the files were in the national interest. So the end justifies the means in my opinion.
    Are we sure of what the end will actually be? And isn't that the problem?

  8. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    410

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    But the owner is the government, and it has been sustained that some of the details in the files were in the national interest. So the end justifies the means in my opinion.
    Who believes a word the government tells us? Not me for one!! Snowden, Assange and that little yank bloke who can't make up his mind which gender he is are all heroes in my book.

  9. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    London N16
    Posts
    675

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eatmywords View Post
    But the owner is the government, and it has been sustained that some of the details in the files were in the national interest. So the end justifies the means in my opinion.
    It's probably because it's Monday, but you've lost me. The owner of what is which government; and what is in whose national interest...?

  10. #30
    Super Moderator eatmywords's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kingston upon Hull
    Posts
    2,473

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Patman Post View Post
    It's probably because it's Monday, but you've lost me. The owner of what is which government; and what is in whose national interest...?
    The people own the government, unless you consider it otherwise, and so whatever output the government produces is for the people. And in Spain's case, is the spying on 60 million of their national citizens' phones is in their national interest, and America's, seeing as Spain is supposed to be an ally of the US? If this kind of behaviour creates a rift in relations, and Germany was considering economic sanctions for the bugging of Merkel's phone, then this kind of flagrant behaviour can only be considered of national interest if socially and economically relations are damaged.

    If you are saying it's better to keep this kind of behaviour secret, to avoid this, then what kind of society is this promoting? This is no different to the behaviour of Communist Russia and the KGB, which America was so vociferous against.
    Faced with certain disaster, defiance is the only answer.

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •